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April 17, 2008


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Benjamin Franklin

These are some of the most un-Christian comments I have encountered in a long time.

Tobien says "and the violent take it by force"

This is antithetical to the commandments Christ gave us. Shame on you!


See, when you conflate evolution with atheism, you're doing a great injustice to scientific inquiry. There are many people who simultaneously accept evolution and God. Their faith doesn't hinge on scientists being wrong or part of an evil conspiracy. Nor does it depend on denial of the wealth of evidence that supports common descent and natural selection.

Intelligent Design is not a science; it is a political and religious movement that is attempting to subvert the scientific process under the guise of "free speech" and "teach the controversy". But at it's core, it is no more scientific than astrology or reincarnation, because it is neither testable nor falsifiable.

It's funny you should mention Stalin, because he specifically rejected Darwinian evolution in favour of a vacuous theory known as Lysenkoism that had no scientific merit.

If you want Intelligent Design to be taught in religion or philosophy classes, then so be it. But let's not pretend it is science simply because it tells us what some of us want to hear. Now that would be a throwback to Lysenkoism under the Stalinist regime.

Richard Fowler

Karl Tobien has elequently stated the facts. I respect his opinion as well as enjoyed his book about his mother's escape from Soviet Union.
"Dancing Under the Red Star"
Christians must be proactive or risk losing future generations to no access to christianity.

Benjamin Franklin


Tobien has perverted the true message of Jesus Christ.

Isn't Jesus's message to us one of love, peace, and turning the other cheek to oppression? God will protect Christianity if he feels it worth preserving.

John Swanson

For Benjamin Franklin: Mr. Tobien didn't say "and the violent take it by force." It is a quote from the Bible. Your ignorance of the Bible shows in your response. The quote Mr. Tobien used is from Matthew 11:12 and it was the Lord Jesus himself that made it. You are also apparently unaware of Jesus' teachings on God's judgement of sin and sinners, Hypocrisy and false teachers. SHAME ON YOU!
For NP: You also are woefully ignorant of the scriptures with regard to the Creation. After the Fall, in our unregenerate condition, we are unable to understand God or his Creation. He will not allow us access to his knowledge or presence in a fallen state. This earthy science we have is thoroughly inadequate to understand God's Universe. He plainly stated in Genesis chapter 1 that the Earth was created on day one and the rest of the Universe on day four. Neither the Big Bang or Evolution work here. God said (not Mr. Tobien), "My ways are higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:9, "the foolishness of God is wiser than the wisdom of men." 1 Corinthians 1:25, "but God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise." 1 Corinthians 1:27, "be not wise in your own conceits." Romans 12:16, Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord:" Isaiah 1:18, "let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts:" Isaiah 55:7. Evolution and God are anathema. If you believe there is a Creator, then He created a perfect science which we have corrupted. God cannot be divorced from His creation or the science by which it is to be understood. If you are confident in the assertions of Evolution, then what have you got to lose in an open debate? It should be relatively easy to logically advance your position. All anyone is asking for is an opportunity to debate the findings. Again, if you believe in God, you have an obligation to properly prepare your children to meet Him. Otherwise, by teaching Evolution, you're only preparing them for the grave. If taking God at His word makes myself, my brother Karl Tobien and others like us fools, then I'm here to tell you, "I'm a fool for JESUS! Who's fool are YOU?

Dan Petrey

Jude not, and you will not be judged. Everyone is in such a hurry to discredit. Opinions and interputation ( with fact and without fact ) are why the reasons that America is such a great place to live, and die. Cast the first stone, and make yourself feel better.

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